Re: Addendum: Fumble into Endzone Question

AMEN!   Since the NCAA is going to change the reffing system to an all-NCAA referee system across the nation, I think the rule book will undergo some more scrutiny.  Since this call is a hard one to make, and has come up in a lot of games that I have seen this season, I think they will review and clarify the rule.  Maybe they'll even change it a little bit.

Here's to the Utes ending a 9-4 season with a great defensive game, and a nice offensive comeback.  And here's to next season! 

Merry Christmas to you as well.

Tijs

On Dec 22, 2007 11:42 AM, Nevin Limburg <nevinlimburg@hotmail.com> wrote:

What  I have concluded from all this is that the next time I need something from my work analysed and dissected I am going to contact my Limburg Nephews.  Way to go guys!  Great game!  I really liked Freddie Brown's (it was him wasn't it?) heads up play to try to stretch that ball to the goal line, right or wrong.  And from what you two have written I am now not convinced that the wrong call was made and that it should have been a touchback.  If indeed it should have been called a touchback, then the rule should be changed about when the ball hits the pylon, because I thought they made the correct call when I saw the relplays and did not have the benefit of the "written like a lawyer" rulebook.  As a layman, it looked to me, the non-biased fan that I am, of course, that it was either a touchdown or placed at the one yard line like they ended up doing.  To just give the ball to the other team as a touchback would have been more unjust no matter how you look at it.  When compared to the UCLA game's touchback, there is no comparison because that ball went all the way through to the end of the endzone.  So figure that, computers of NCAA and come up with something better!  Anyway, thanks for the education nephews. and I'm already getting excited for next year's team with Johnson back, Mack, a slew of those young receivers and defensive guys, Asiata, offensive line, and our resident All American Louie.  But you watch, and I guarantee it, BYU will still be the odds on favorite for the MWC championship, and Im ok with that because Utah has traditionally done better not being in first place at the beginning.  Then when we beat Michigan to open the season in the Big House, ala Apalachian State (who the heck are those guys?) everyone will be after the new M coaches head again.  Ha!
 
Uncle Nevin Merry Christmas!

"We should be too big to take offense, and too noble to give it."

Abraham Lincoln

 

Nevin Limburg, CEcD
Business Development Manager
Economic Development / Redevelopment Agency
West Valley City, Utah
Office:  801-963-3322

cell: 801-232-0542

---

Date: Fri, 21 Dec 2007 12:00:13 -0700
From: tijis311@gmail.com
To: dmx311@gmail.com; Garth.Limburg@slcgov.com; nevinlimburg@hotmail.com
Subject: Re: Addendum: Fumble into Endzone Question

Right.  And that is just it.  They don't clarify enough in regards to the ball hitting the pylon whether it needs to be in possesion or not, what direction the ball can hit it from, etc. etc.

 

Interestingly, the only plane that exists is the endzone.  This means that if the ball were to be above the out of bounds line, but never touched anything out of bounds, a player could take the ball and recover it, as long as he remains inbounds.

 

Also, the forward progress on a fumble doesn't only apply to a recovery.  It does apply to going out of bounds (since there can be no recovery):

 

c. If a live ball not in player possession crosses a boundary line and then is declared out of bounds, it is out of bounds at the crossing point.   (not at the point at which it lands out of bounds, as this could theoretically be yards ahead of the crossing point.)

 

Here is a link to the interpretations book.  This will come in handy for next season:

http://www.ncaa.org/library/rules/2007/2007_football_rules.pdf

On 12/21/07, Eric Limburg <dmx311@gmail.com> wrote:

I believe that the fumbling forward only applies if you are the team who fumbled and recovers the fumble and it has been advanced.  If the ball were to touch a player of the opposite team after the fumble or say get kicked or pushed in the "advancing" position favoring the team that fumbled it would be spotted in the new "advanced" position due to contact with the other player. 

 

As for as I can interpret from the rules you sent on the ball hitting the pylon issue, the pylon is out of bounds and since the nose of the ball hit the front of the pylon (not the side) on it's way out of bounds (it had already crossed the "out of bounds plane") it would fall under the rule that a loose ball is ruled out of bounds once it hits something that is on the line or out of bounds.  If the pylons, theoretically, were not there and calls were to be judged by video or referee vision (not sure if either one would be better than the other, haha) based soley on planes and the field lines this ball would have never crossed the goal line or the touch down plane.  It was clearly outside of this by the time it hit the pylon and cannot be considered to have gone "out of the back of the endzone" or the "side of the endzone" since it was angled in a direction aleady out of bounds. 

 

By this logic I believe they got the original call correct and with the video evidence accessed the same although they were not able to confirm the call with the video evidence.

 

Now however in contrast citing the case of the Wyoming game when a similar thing happened, the ball (if my memory serves me correctly) hit the inside side of the pylon.  The inside wall of the pylons are in direct correlation with the endzone plane and the out of bounds lines with the rest of the wall surfaces are not.

 

Looks like from this we need laser technology to step in and support both human intelligence and video evidence.

 

On Dec 21, 2007 10:43 AM, Tijs Limburg <tijis311@gmail.com> wrote:

The rulebook also states that a player cannot fumble forward while the player is moving out of bounds.  This is part of the rule to prevent the offense from being able to intentionally fumble forward and recover the ball in the endzone for a touchdown.

 

The ball was clearly moving forward.

 

On 12/21/07, Tijs Limburg <tijis311@gmail.com > wrote:

That fumble call last night looks like it is getting messier.  The officials released a post-game statement saying that the call should have been a touchback.  I looked to see if I could find any info in the rulebook for further enlightenment.

 

Unfortunately, the rulebook is not available online (the NCAA should change this), so I couldn't go directly to the citation the officials gave in their statement.  However, there is a "rules and interpretations" book available from the NCAA online, and so I looked into it.  Below is what the book says on the issue of fumbling out of bounds, and touchbacks.

 

Read Articles 2 and 3 of section 2.  There is obviously a difference between a held ball and a loose ball.  In part b, are they talking about a loose ball hitting the pylon?  If so, then the officials should have ruled it a touchback.  ("behind the goal line" means the same as "crossing the plane"). 

 

 

Here is what the rule book says on fumbles, as cited in the interpretations book:

 

SECTION 2. Out of Bounds

Held Ball Out of Bounds

ARTICLE 2. A ball in player possession is out of bounds when either the

ball or any part of the runner touches the ground or anything else that

is on or outside a boundary line except another player or game official.

Ball Out of Bounds

ARTICLE 3. a. Aball not in player possession, other than a kick that scores

a field goal, is out of bounds when it touches the ground, a player, a

game official or anything else that is on or outside a boundary line.

b. Aball that touches a pylon is out of bounds behind the goal line.

SECTION 6. Touchback

When Declared

ARTICLE 1. It is a touchback when:

a. The ball becomes dead out of bounds behind a goal line, except from an

incompleted forward pass, or becomes dead in the possession of a player

on, above or behind his own goal line and the attacking team is

responsible for the ball being there (A.R. 6-3-9-IV, A.R. 7-2-4-I, A.R. 8-6-

1-I and II, and A.R. 10-2-2-XXXIX) (Rules 7-2-4-a and b).

b. Akick becomes dead by rule behind the defending team's goal line and

the attacking team is responsible for the ball being there (

Exception:

Rule 8-4-2-b) (A.R. 6-3-4-IV).

c. Aviolation by the kicking team occurs in the receiving team's end zone.

 

SECTION 7. Responsibility and Impetus

 

Responsibility

 

ARTICLE 1. The team responsible for the ball being out of bounds behind

a goal line or being dead in the possession of a player on, above or behind

a goal line is the team whose player carries the ball or imparts an impetus

to it that forces it on, above or across the goal line, or is responsible for a

loose ball being on, above or behind the goal line (A.R. 6-3-4-I).

Initial Impetus

ARTICLE 2. a. The impetus imparted by a player who kicks, passes, snaps

or fumbles the ball shall be considered responsible for the ball's

progress in any direction even though its course is deflected or reversed

after striking the ground or after touching an official or a player of either

team (A.R. 6-3-4-IV; A.R. 8-5-1-II, III, VIII, IX and XI; and A.R. 8-7-2-IIX).

b. Initial impetus is considered expended and the responsibility for the

ball's progress is charged to a player:

1. If he kicks a ball not in player possession or bats a loose ball after it

strikes the ground (

Exception: The original impetus is not changed

when a loose ball is batted or kicked in the end zone) (A.R. 8-7-2-V).

2. If the ball comes to rest and he gives it new impetus by any contact

with it.

Exceptions:

1. Rules 6-1-4-a and 6-3-4-a (A.R. 6-3-4-I-IV).

2. The original impetus is not changed when a ball at rest in the end

zone is moved when touched by an official or a player.

c. Aloose ball retains its original status when there is new impetus.

Anyway, appearently there have been other issues with officials ruling an "out of bounds plane" (which is not in the rulebook, apparently).  If you google the issue, there are quite a few references to the issue.

 

Looks like the NCAA needs to clarify a little better.

--
Tijs Limburg
Chairman and CTO of DMX - Digital Media eXceleron, Inc.
Get eXcited!
www.dmxed.com

Blogs:
http://phystrings.blogspot.com/
http://getoutofthedark.blogspot.com/

The "Don't Tread on Me" Flag: The First Navy Jack is enjoying renewed popularity these days thanks to an order from the Secretary of the Navy that directs all U.S. Navy ships to fly the First Navy Jack for the duration of the War on Terrorism.

--
Tijs Limburg
Chairman and CTO of DMX - Digital Media eXceleron, Inc.
Get eXcited!
www.dmxed.com

Blogs:
http://phystrings.blogspot.com/
http://getoutofthedark.blogspot.com/

The "Don't Tread on Me" Flag: The First Navy Jack is enjoying renewed popularity these days thanks to an order from the Secretary of the Navy that directs all U.S. Navy ships to fly the First Navy Jack for the duration of the War on Terrorism.

--
Eric Limburg

-President
DMX, Digital Media eXceleron Inc.
www.dmxed.com
-Home Entertainment- -Business IT- -Networks-

-Sound/Recording Engineer
eXceleron Records and DJ Service
www.eXedmusic.com

(801) 938-5DMX office
(801) 633-2239 cell

--
Tijs Limburg
Chairman and CTO of DMX - Digital Media eXceleron, Inc.
Get eXcited!
www.dmxed.com

Blogs:
http://phystrings.blogspot.com/
http://getoutofthedark.blogspot.com/

The "Don't Tread on Me" Flag: The First Navy Jack is enjoying renewed popularity these days thanks to an order from the Secretary of the Navy that directs all U.S. Navy ships to fly the First Navy Jack for the duration of the War on Terrorism.

---

Get the power of Windows + Web with the new Windows Live. Get it now!

--
Tijs Limburg
Chairman and CTO of DMX - Digital Media eXceleron, Inc.
Get eXcited!
www.dmxed.com

Blogs:
http://phystrings.blogspot.com/
http://getoutofthedark.blogspot.com/

The "Don't Tread on Me" Flag: The First Navy Jack is enjoying renewed popularity these days thanks to an order from the Secretary of the Navy that directs all U.S. Navy ships to fly the First Navy Jack for the duration of the War on Terrorism.

Re: Addendum: Fumble into Endzone Question

Right.  And that is just it.  They don't clarify enough in regards to the ball hitting the pylon whether it needs to be in possesion or not, what direction the ball can hit it from, etc. etc.

 

Interestingly, the only plane that exists is the endzone.  This means that if the ball were to be above the out of bounds line, but never touched anything out of bounds, a player could take the ball and recover it, as long as he remains inbounds.

 

Also, the forward progress on a fumble doesn't only apply to a recovery.  It does apply to going out of bounds (since there can be no recovery):

 

c. If a live ball not in player possession crosses a boundary line and then is declared out of bounds, it is out of bounds at the crossing point.   (not at the point at which it lands out of bounds, as this could theoretically be yards ahead of the crossing point.)

 

Here is a link to the interpretations book.  This will come in handy for next season:

http://www.ncaa.org/library/rules/2007/2007_football_rules.pdf

On 12/21/07, Eric Limburg <dmx311@gmail.com> wrote:

I believe that the fumbling forward only applies if you are the team who fumbled and recovers the fumble and it has been advanced.  If the ball were to touch a player of the opposite team after the fumble or say get kicked or pushed in the "advancing" position favoring the team that fumbled it would be spotted in the new "advanced" position due to contact with the other player. 

 

As for as I can interpret from the rules you sent on the ball hitting the pylon issue, the pylon is out of bounds and since the nose of the ball hit the front of the pylon (not the side) on it's way out of bounds (it had already crossed the "out of bounds plane") it would fall under the rule that a loose ball is ruled out of bounds once it hits something that is on the line or out of bounds.  If the pylons, theoretically, were not there and calls were to be judged by video or referee vision (not sure if either one would be better than the other, haha) based soley on planes and the field lines this ball would have never crossed the goal line or the touch down plane.  It was clearly outside of this by the time it hit the pylon and cannot be considered to have gone "out of the back of the endzone" or the "side of the endzone" since it was angled in a direction aleady out of bounds. 

 

By this logic I believe they got the original call correct and with the video evidence accessed the same although they were not able to confirm the call with the video evidence.

 

Now however in contrast citing the case of the Wyoming game when a similar thing happened, the ball (if my memory serves me correctly) hit the inside side of the pylon.  The inside wall of the pylons are in direct correlation with the endzone plane and the out of bounds lines with the rest of the wall surfaces are not.

 

Looks like from this we need laser technology to step in and support both human intelligence and video evidence.

 

On Dec 21, 2007 10:43 AM, Tijs Limburg <tijis311@gmail.com> wrote:

The rulebook also states that a player cannot fumble forward while the player is moving out of bounds.  This is part of the rule to prevent the offense from being able to intentionally fumble forward and recover the ball in the endzone for a touchdown.

 

The ball was clearly moving forward.

 

On 12/21/07, Tijs Limburg <tijis311@gmail.com > wrote:

That fumble call last night looks like it is getting messier.  The officials released a post-game statement saying that the call should have been a touchback.  I looked to see if I could find any info in the rulebook for further enlightenment.

 

Unfortunately, the rulebook is not available online (the NCAA should change this), so I couldn't go directly to the citation the officials gave in their statement.  However, there is a "rules and interpretations" book available from the NCAA online, and so I looked into it.  Below is what the book says on the issue of fumbling out of bounds, and touchbacks.

 

Read Articles 2 and 3 of section 2.  There is obviously a difference between a held ball and a loose ball.  In part b, are they talking about a loose ball hitting the pylon?  If so, then the officials should have ruled it a touchback.  ("behind the goal line" means the same as "crossing the plane"). 

 

 

Here is what the rule book says on fumbles, as cited in the interpretations book:

 

SECTION 2. Out of Bounds

Held Ball Out of Bounds

ARTICLE 2. A ball in player possession is out of bounds when either the

ball or any part of the runner touches the ground or anything else that

is on or outside a boundary line except another player or game official.

Ball Out of Bounds

ARTICLE 3. a. Aball not in player possession, other than a kick that scores

a field goal, is out of bounds when it touches the ground, a player, a

game official or anything else that is on or outside a boundary line.

b. Aball that touches a pylon is out of bounds behind the goal line.

SECTION 6. Touchback

When Declared

ARTICLE 1. It is a touchback when:

a. The ball becomes dead out of bounds behind a goal line, except from an

incompleted forward pass, or becomes dead in the possession of a player

on, above or behind his own goal line and the attacking team is

responsible for the ball being there (A.R. 6-3-9-IV, A.R. 7-2-4-I, A.R. 8-6-

1-I and II, and A.R. 10-2-2-XXXIX) (Rules 7-2-4-a and b).

b. Akick becomes dead by rule behind the defending team's goal line and

the attacking team is responsible for the ball being there (

Exception:

Rule 8-4-2-b) (A.R. 6-3-4-IV).

c. Aviolation by the kicking team occurs in the receiving team's end zone.

 

SECTION 7. Responsibility and Impetus

 

Responsibility

 

ARTICLE 1. The team responsible for the ball being out of bounds behind

a goal line or being dead in the possession of a player on, above or behind

a goal line is the team whose player carries the ball or imparts an impetus

to it that forces it on, above or across the goal line, or is responsible for a

loose ball being on, above or behind the goal line (A.R. 6-3-4-I).

Initial Impetus

ARTICLE 2. a. The impetus imparted by a player who kicks, passes, snaps

or fumbles the ball shall be considered responsible for the ball's

progress in any direction even though its course is deflected or reversed

after striking the ground or after touching an official or a player of either

team (A.R. 6-3-4-IV; A.R. 8-5-1-II, III, VIII, IX and XI; and A.R. 8-7-2-IIX).

b. Initial impetus is considered expended and the responsibility for the

ball's progress is charged to a player:

1. If he kicks a ball not in player possession or bats a loose ball after it

strikes the ground (

Exception: The original impetus is not changed

when a loose ball is batted or kicked in the end zone) (A.R. 8-7-2-V).

2. If the ball comes to rest and he gives it new impetus by any contact

with it.

Exceptions:

1. Rules 6-1-4-a and 6-3-4-a (A.R. 6-3-4-I-IV).

2. The original impetus is not changed when a ball at rest in the end

zone is moved when touched by an official or a player.

c. Aloose ball retains its original status when there is new impetus.

Anyway, appearently there have been other issues with officials ruling an "out of bounds plane" (which is not in the rulebook, apparently).  If you google the issue, there are quite a few references to the issue.

 

Looks like the NCAA needs to clarify a little better.

--
Tijs Limburg
Chairman and CTO of DMX - Digital Media eXceleron, Inc.
Get eXcited!
www.dmxed.com

Blogs:
http://phystrings.blogspot.com/
http://getoutofthedark.blogspot.com/

The "Don't Tread on Me" Flag: The First Navy Jack is enjoying renewed popularity these days thanks to an order from the Secretary of the Navy that directs all U.S. Navy ships to fly the First Navy Jack for the duration of the War on Terrorism.

--
Tijs Limburg
Chairman and CTO of DMX - Digital Media eXceleron, Inc.
Get eXcited!
www.dmxed.com

Blogs:
http://phystrings.blogspot.com/
http://getoutofthedark.blogspot.com/

The "Don't Tread on Me" Flag: The First Navy Jack is enjoying renewed popularity these days thanks to an order from the Secretary of the Navy that directs all U.S. Navy ships to fly the First Navy Jack for the duration of the War on Terrorism.

--
Eric Limburg

-President
DMX, Digital Media eXceleron Inc.
www.dmxed.com
-Home Entertainment- -Business IT- -Networks-

-Sound/Recording Engineer
eXceleron Records and DJ Service
www.eXedmusic.com

(801) 938-5DMX office
(801) 633-2239 cell

--
Tijs Limburg
Chairman and CTO of DMX - Digital Media eXceleron, Inc.
Get eXcited!
www.dmxed.com

Blogs:
http://phystrings.blogspot.com/
http://getoutofthedark.blogspot.com/

The "Don't Tread on Me" Flag: The First Navy Jack is enjoying renewed popularity these days thanks to an order from the Secretary of the Navy that directs all U.S. Navy ships to fly the First Navy Jack for the duration of the War on Terrorism.

Fumble into Endzone Question

That fumble call last night looks like it is getting messier.  The officials released a post-game statement saying that the call should have been a touchback.  I looked to see if I could find any info in the rulebook for further enlightenment.

 

Unfortunately, the rulebook is not available online (the NCAA should change this), so I couldn't go directly to the citation the officials gave in their statement.  However, there is a "rules and interpretations" book available from the NCAA online, and so I looked into it.  Below is what the book says on the issue of fumbling out of bounds, and touchbacks.

 

Read Articles 2 and 3 of section 2.  There is obviously a difference between a held ball and a loose ball.  In part b, are they talking about a loose ball hitting the pylon?  If so, then the officials should have ruled it a touchback.  ("behind the goal line" means the same as "crossing the plane"). 

 

 

Here is what the rule book says on fumbles, as cited in the interpretations book:

 

SECTION 2. Out of Bounds

Held Ball Out of Bounds

ARTICLE 2. A ball in player possession is out of bounds when either the

ball or any part of the runner touches the ground or anything else that

is on or outside a boundary line except another player or game official.

Ball Out of Bounds

ARTICLE 3. a. Aball not in player possession, other than a kick that scores

a field goal, is out of bounds when it touches the ground, a player, a

game official or anything else that is on or outside a boundary line.

b. Aball that touches a pylon is out of bounds behind the goal line.

SECTION 6. Touchback

When Declared

ARTICLE 1. It is a touchback when:

a. The ball becomes dead out of bounds behind a goal line, except from an

incompleted forward pass, or becomes dead in the possession of a player

on, above or behind his own goal line and the attacking team is

responsible for the ball being there (A.R. 6-3-9-IV, A.R. 7-2-4-I, A.R. 8-6-

1-I and II, and A.R. 10-2-2-XXXIX) (Rules 7-2-4-a and b).

b. Akick becomes dead by rule behind the defending team's goal line and

the attacking team is responsible for the ball being there (

Exception:

Rule 8-4-2-b) (A.R. 6-3-4-IV).

c. Aviolation by the kicking team occurs in the receiving team's end zone.

 

SECTION 7. Responsibility and Impetus

 

Responsibility

 

ARTICLE 1. The team responsible for the ball being out of bounds behind

a goal line or being dead in the possession of a player on, above or behind

a goal line is the team whose player carries the ball or imparts an impetus

to it that forces it on, above or across the goal line, or is responsible for a

loose ball being on, above or behind the goal line (A.R. 6-3-4-I).

Initial Impetus

ARTICLE 2. a. The impetus imparted by a player who kicks, passes, snaps

or fumbles the ball shall be considered responsible for the ball's

progress in any direction even though its course is deflected or reversed

after striking the ground or after touching an official or a player of either

team (A.R. 6-3-4-IV; A.R. 8-5-1-II, III, VIII, IX and XI; and A.R. 8-7-2-IIX).

b. Initial impetus is considered expended and the responsibility for the

ball's progress is charged to a player:

1. If he kicks a ball not in player possession or bats a loose ball after it

strikes the ground (

Exception: The original impetus is not changed

when a loose ball is batted or kicked in the end zone) (A.R. 8-7-2-V).

2. If the ball comes to rest and he gives it new impetus by any contact

with it.

Exceptions:

1. Rules 6-1-4-a and 6-3-4-a (A.R. 6-3-4-I-IV).

2. The original impetus is not changed when a ball at rest in the end

zone is moved when touched by an official or a player.

c. Aloose ball retains its original status when there is new impetus.

Anyway, appearently there have been other issues with officials ruling an "out of bounds plane" (which is not in the rulebook, apparently).  If you google the issue, there are quite a few references to the issue.

 

Looks like the NCAA needs to clarify a little better.

--
Tijs Limburg
Chairman and CTO of DMX - Digital Media eXceleron, Inc.
Get eXcited!
www.dmxed.com

Blogs:
http://phystrings.blogspot.com/
http://getoutofthedark.blogspot.com/

The "Don't Tread on Me" Flag: The First Navy Jack is enjoying renewed popularity these days thanks to an order from the Secretary of the Navy that directs all U.S. Navy ships to fly the First Navy Jack for the duration of the War on Terrorism.

Fourth Down and 18

Message put on the Deseret News comment board in regards to an article:

You are spot on with your analysis of the Utah losses to BYU over the past several years.  I have attended most of them and seen first hand what you are talking about.  What amazes me is that Kyle Whittingham has been involved in everyone of them and Bronco has not.  Kyle should be keenly aware of what is required to "close the deal".  Yet, he stated in the Tribune today that no one play decides a game.  Are you kidding?  Of course one play can decide a game!  As long as Kyle continues with this assessment he will continue to lose the close ones.  I am a Utah season ticket holder and I want Kyle to succeed in every way.  May I suggest one simple thing?  In fourth down situations with the game on the line when a defensive stop will win it all, spend a time out and get the players on the same page and review coverages and assignments.  Make sure the players understand the situation and what their assignments are.  There is no sense saving your time outs when the opposing team beats you in a fourth down situation.

I completely agree.  Spending a time out to help ensure a broken play for BYU on a 4th and 18 is critical.  Guess how many time outs we had left last year at the end of the game when we lost on that last play? 

 

Whit is like Jerry Sloan in this regard.  He saves his time outs as if they'll pay him interest in a savings bank.  Note to both of them:  Time outs are like options, they can have huge payoffs, but THEY EXPIRE at the end of the half. 

 

One other note.  How long has it been since two MWC teams have been in the top 25 this close to the end of the season?  The WAC has two.  And if Hawaii can hang on and beat Washington, they'll be in the BCS for sure.

 

If that happens, the WAC will get back to back years of BCS money.  It has been 3 years since the MWC sent Utah to the Fiesta Bowl.

 

This is why I hate BYU winning the Conference all the time.  They are not very good at beating teams outside of the conference, so what good is it to win the conference championship when you can't go out and represent the MWC to the other big boys.

 

The MWC needs to come up with a special trophy award for the team that wins the most NON-CONFERENCE games so that there is more motivation to go out and defeat those other teams.  The award should include regular season and bowl games.

 

Lastly, look at some of the teams in the Top 25.  Some have 8-4 records, so the Utes should not get down on themselves for their 8-4 record.  They have improved over last year and I think they will continue to get better.

 

Go Utes

 

-Tijs

Re: Rivalry Week---my final point comparisons of common components

All,

 

Here are some interesting stats I looked up.  According to these stats, Utah has a slight edge due to special teams and our D. 

 

Keep in mind, these stats cover the entire season.  What is interesting is that the season advantage is slightly in Utah's favor, but as Nevin's stats pointed out, our recent stats show a larger advantage, because our improvement is accelerating.  Case in point: below you will see that Utah's season average of points allowed per game is 13.6.  Compare that with the current, 3 game average of 4.33 per game.  (and I don't think you can claim that is due to lesser caliber teams - except for CSU.  But even they scored more points on us than Wyoming.)

 

Scoreless or TD-less games for the opponent this season:

BYU: 0

Utah: 3

Scoreless Quarters

Defense (Opponent didn't score):

BYU:  17

Utah: 21

Offense:

BYU: 3

Utah: 11

Total Points scored this season:  

Utes:                                296                                      BYU: 309                

Average Points Per Game: 27                                               : 31 

Average Points Per Quarter: 6.7                                            :7.7    

Difference:  BYU scores 1 point per quarter and 4 points per game more than the Utes.

Points Allowed:

Utes:                                 150                                    BYU: 188

Average Points Per Game:  13.6                                          : 18.8   

Average Points Per Quarter: 3.4                                           : 4.7

Difference:  BYU allows 1.3 points per quarter and 5.2 points per game more than the Utes.

Advantage: Utah

GO UTES!

Tijs

 

 

On 11/19/07, Tijs Limburg <tijis311@gmail.com> wrote:

It is nice to see BYU in the top 25 this morning at 23.  It gives our conference some recognition... but it also bolsters our chances of beating them.  The Top 25 this year have had trouble with unranked teams.

 

Funny, BYU fans were all mocking us ealier in the season for the fact that we play well against ranked teams and choke against pathetically unranked teams like UNLV.

 

BYU is now ranked.  They should be afraid.

 
 

On 11/19/07, Bruce Gundersen <bruceg@chpdc.com > wrote:

In fact, the two non-conference wins were against teams who were in the top ten to start the year.

 

From: Tijs Limburg [mailto:tijis311@gmail.com ]
Sent: Monday, November 19, 2007 9:10 AM
To: Nevin Limburg
Cc: garth.limburg@slcgov.com ; beaner230112@yahoo.com; bruceg@chpdc.com; dmx311@gmail.com; dnacurtis@yahoo.com; mikecu@schiffnutrition.com; klcbrazil@cascadeaccess.com
Subject: Re: Rivalry Week---my final point comparisons of common components

 

I think it should be added that the Utes beat 2 of 3 nonconference teams, BYU did not. 

 

Utah also has won 4 on the road.  BYU has only won 3. 

 

With Utah's record in Provo recently, and the ability to win on the road, this will be a great game.  I hope it is Utah by 16, but Utah by a TD will suffice for me.

 

Tijs

 

On 11/18/07, Nevin Limburg <nevinlimburg@hotmail.com> wrote:

Well, things turned to the "dark" Crimson red side after the weekend scores.  See the attached excel spreadsheet (makes it professional and authentic).  The Utes have a +16 point spread advantage going into the big game.  enjoy!
 
Nevin

'We should be too big to take offense, and too noble to give it.'

Abraham Lincoln

 

Nevin Limburg, CEcD
Business Development Manager
Economic Development / Redevelopment Agency
West Valley City, Utah
Office:  801-963-3322

cell: 801-232-0542

 

---

You keep typing, we keep giving. Download Messenger and join the i'm Initiative now. Join in!

--
Tijs Limburg
Chairman and CTO of DMX - Digital Media eXceleron, Inc.
Get eXcited!
www.dmxed.com

Blogs:
http://phystrings.blogspot.com/
http://getoutofthedark.blogspot.com/

The "Don't Tread on Me" Flag: The First Navy Jack is enjoying renewed popularity these days thanks to an order from the Secretary of the Navy that directs all U.S. Navy ships to fly the First Navy Jack for the duration of the War on Terrorism.

No virus found in this incoming message.
Checked by AVG Free Edition.
Version: 7.5.503 / Virus Database: 269.16.0/1139 - Release Date: 11/19/2007 12:35 PM

No virus found in this outgoing message.
Checked by AVG Free Edition.
Version: 7.5.503 / Virus Database: 269.16.0/1139 - Release Date: 11/19/2007 12:35 PM

--
Tijs Limburg
Chairman and CTO of DMX - Digital Media eXceleron, Inc.
Get eXcited!
www.dmxed.com

Blogs:
http://phystrings.blogspot.com/
http://getoutofthedark.blogspot.com/

The "Don't Tread on Me" Flag: The First Navy Jack is enjoying renewed popularity these days thanks to an order from the Secretary of the Navy that directs all U.S. Navy ships to fly the First Navy Jack for the duration of the War on Terrorism.

--
Tijs Limburg
Chairman and CTO of DMX - Digital Media eXceleron, Inc.
Get eXcited!
www.dmxed.com

Blogs:
http://phystrings.blogspot.com/
http://getoutofthedark.blogspot.com/

The "Don't Tread on Me" Flag: The First Navy Jack is enjoying renewed popularity these days thanks to an order from the Secretary of the Navy that directs all U.S. Navy ships to fly the First Navy Jack for the duration of the War on Terrorism.

Fwd: Rivalry Week---my final point comparisons of common components

Great point.  Go Utes!

 

Garth

Subject: Re: Rivalry Week---my final point comparisons of common components

 

It is nice to see BYU in the top 25 this morning at 23.  It gives our conference some recognition... but it also bolsters our chances of beating them.  The Top 25 this year have had trouble with unranked teams.

 

Funny, BYU fans were all mocking us ealier in the season for the fact that we play well against ranked teams and choke against pathetically unranked teams like UNLV.

 

BYU is now ranked.  They should be afraid.

Tijs
 

 

Fwd: Rivalry Week---my final point comparisons of common components

In fact, the two non-conference wins were against teams who were in the top ten to start the year.

Bruce

Fwd: Rivalry Week---my final point comparisons of common components

Let's not forget, too, in the last three games, the Ute defence has held SDS, Wyo, and NM to a total of 13 points, an avg. of 4.33/game.  Wow!  So, should I predict 20.33 to 4.33, Utah, to get my 16 pt spread?  Or should we make it 26.33 - 10.33?  Take your pick.
 
Nevin

Fwd: Rivalry Week---my final point comparisons of common components

How about we return the favor from last year and score on a Utah hook-and-lateral like Boise St did.  Of course when we do it this time there will be almost no time left on the clock in the 4th and it will be tied.  That will erase that stupid Beck to Harline cloud that BYU has been haning over our heads the last year.  KSL Radio was so stupid this morning to start jabs on Utah.  The sports announcer was saying how cool it was that again it's rivalry week and that it will be a very good matchup since both teams are on 7 game winning streaks.  Then he said, "But despite the outcome this weekend BYU will always have this up on Utah..." and they proceeded to play a soundbite from the last play of last years game.  So even if Utah beats BYU this week down in Provo, BYU will always be better than Utah because of that play?  Whatever!  I can't wait to see our defense take the field on Saturday and crush Max Hall.  He thought Wyoming was tough just wait until he sees the defense of Kyle Whittingham and the Utes!

Fwd: Rivalry Week---my final point comparisons of common components

I think it should be added that the Utes beat 2 of 3 nonconference teams, BYU did not.

Utah also has won 4 on the road. BYU has only won 3.

With Utah's record in Provo recently, and the ability to win on the road, this will be a great game. I hope it is Utah by 16, but Utah by a TD will suffice for me.

Tijs

Well, things turned to the "dark" Crimson red side after the weekend scores. See the attached excel spreadsheet (makes it professional and authentic). The Utes have a +16 point spread advantage going into the big game. enjoy!

Nevin

'We should be too big to take offense, and too noble to give it.'

Abraham Lincoln

Nevin Limburg,

---

You keep typing, we keep giving. Download Messenger and join the i'm Initiative now. Join in!

Fwd: CSTV

Right on.

Bruce

Funny.  Now that I have been paying attention more to CSTV's ticker, since you pointed it out to me, it bugs me.  Don't know if they changed their screen format from last year or just started adding "stupid news" recently but I have to say now that I agree with the fact that they clutter up too much of the screen.  I have to be honest I don't think I have watched an entire game on CSTV this season so that may be another reason I didn't notice as much.  But like the DesNews said, "at least it's not the mtn."  So now you have to pick the lesser of 2 evils.  It will be nice to see Utah on ESPN tonight even though the announcers will probably bash us and we will get our butts handed to us by Louisville at least you will be able to see it in HD and I will see it in almost HD (better than CSTV and MTN).  We might even be able to catch a few replays... imagine that!  Go Utes.

Eric

My points exactly.  I will not watch CSTV.  Make sure to read the last four or so paragraphs (marked in bold) of this article.  Did I say the same thing or not?

Garth

 

 

College football on CSTV sophomoric

By Scott D. Pierce
Deseret Morning News

Published: October 5, 2007

The powers that be at the Mountain West Conference and its television partners would like us to believe that games televised on CSTV are national telecasts, which, of course, they are not.

When a channel is available in fewer than one in five homes in America, it's really hard to make a believable argument out of that contention.

But CSTV is not The mtn., at least, and chances are that Ute and Cougar fans across the country can find their team on CSTV — even if they have to go to their computers.

But, leaving all that aside, what kind of job does CSTV do when it telecasts Mountain West games?

Adequate, for the most part. With some moments of astonishing stupidity.

During last week's BYU-at-New Mexico game, for example, CSTV updated the score of, um, 15th-ranked Sam Houston State's game against Oklahoma State for hours. Really.

Wasn't anybody at CSTV watching their own telecast? Or weren't they paying any attention to the annoying graphics that clutter up too much of the screen?

Honestly, it's hard to complain too much about any Mountain West Conference game that makes it on TV. Providing, of course, you can see it.

But, at the same time, the production values on CSTV aren't as good as those on ESPN. Heck, they aren't as good as those on the Big Ten Network.

(They're better than what we see on The mtn., but then so are the production values on KJZZ's coverage of high school football.)

Part of this is budget, obviously. You get what you pay for. And, during the BYU-New Mexico game, CSTV wasn't even paying for that graphic yellow line that indicates the first-down yardage.

(We've become so accustomed to that thing that it's instantly noticeable if it's not there.)

And CSTV isn't paying for first-string broadcast talent, either. Tom Hart and Trev Alberts were, at best, adequate during the Cougars- Lobos game. And sometimes less than that.

There were times when it hardly seemed that Hart was even paying attention to what was happening on the field. In the space of less than three minutes of game time, he first told viewers that BYU punter C.J. Santiago had gotten off a 91-yard punt, which was clearly impossible (given that the line of scrimmage was BYU's 20-yard line).

Then, minutes after Santiago's punt was picked up at New Mexico's 5 and returned to the 8, he punted again and kicked it into the end zone, Hart told viewers, "Two punts tonight, two touchbacks."

There were a number of other head-scratching moments that detracted from the telecast, but Hart and Trev Alberts made the biggest mistake sportscasters can make — we care about the game, we don't care about you. And all your chit-chat about yourselves was not only annoying, it got in the way of what was going on on the field at times.

Um, we couldn't possibly have cared less about a soda pop can with Alberts' picture on it.

There's no quick fix to that, but there is a fix to one other problem — too many graphics cluttering the screen. We don't need both the top of the screen and the bottom graphic-ed up during the entire game.

We particularly don't need a graphic at the bottom of the screen distractingly flashing about "breaking news" every few minutes. Particularly when nobody at CSTV seems to understand what either "news" or "breaking" are.

The arrest of a former Arkansas quarterback (1996-99) for drunken driving is barely news anywhere outside of Fayetteville and Little Rock. A high school player verbally committing to Michigan is barely news even in Ann Arbor.

And, when the same "breaking news" flashes on the bottom of the screen time after time, hour after hour, it's NOT breaking news. "Breaking" indicates something that has just happened (or at least something you've just learned about).

Sigh.

Ah, well. At least it wasn't on The mtn.

---

E-mail: pierce@desnews.com

© 2007 Deseret News Publishing Company | All rights reserved

 

U of U Questions

A.  With the injuries suffered that affected the first few games especially, to end up 9-3 would be fantastic, and a mark of true coaching excellence.  The Staff would deverve a medal.
 
Nevin

 
E. Bring back Jim Fassel to run the offense. 

PS. Did you see Philly last night? One week after a record setting
 performance and win (ala UCLA) they looked absolutely terrible (ala
UNLV). Even the pros have a hard time with consistency. Sometimes
 changing coaches is not the answer. Look at the Charges. Two losses
 last year under Marty Schottenheimer (?) to not able to win this year
 under Norm Turner. 
 


Questions:

 
If Utah goes undefeated the rest of the season (while unlikely, they
 have the talent to do so) what does Dr Hill do at the end of the season?

 
A. Congratulate Kyle for a very good season (but we still won't be
 conf champs)
B. Fire the whole staff for being underachievers
 C. Give Kyle an ultimatum of an OCC next year or be gone
 D. Require Kyle to re-vamp his coaching staff or face dismissal
 E. ________________?

2007 Season Shows Need for Playoff - Again

Well, week 5 in NCAA football showed me why there needs to be a playoff in College Football.  And as the weeks - and years - add up, it is getting more maddening that there are not enough people together on the issue to get it to happen.

 

Just look at the week 5 turnout for the top 25:

 

#3   OU fell to Colorado

#4   Florida fell to Auburn

#7   Texas fell to Kansas St.

#10 Rutgers fell to Maryland

#13 Clemson fell to Georgia Tech

#21 Penn State fell to Illinois

#22 Alabama fell to Florida State

 

 

Notice that the top 25 teams that were playing lower ranked teams and lost all lost to unranked teams this week, except for #5 West Virginia who lost to #18 South Florida (still an exceptional loss).

 

That means that at least 8 teams will have significantly lower rankings come monday.  I would almost like to see how many teams so far have hit the top 25 and left it so far this season.  I think I can name a few off the top of my head, such as BSU, UCLA, Louisville, Fresno St., Michigan, TCU, Georgia Tech, and Texas A&M. 

 

And I'm sure there are others that I am not thinking of at this moment.

 

And we all know that this has been going on all season.  And don't even talk about Notre Dame.

 

In reality, it is too bad that the teams in the MWC that were ranked at the top - Utah, BYU, and TCU - all stumbled at the beginning of the season.  Had they won those games they lost, they would all have a good chance of being ranked.

 

This season is definately getting interesting.

Tijs

Fwd: ESPN

I tuned in and watched the NFL football game last night on ESPN HD.  I was thrilled to find no scrolling sports ticker at the bottom of the screen and no banner across the top of the screen.  Just one small graphic at the bottom middle of the screen showing the score, time, quarter, and down.  The rest of the screen was filled with a beautiful football game.  On some replays the graphic at the bottom even disappeared.  I see where the BYU game this Saturday is on CSTV.  I guess I won't watch that game if CSTV continues to fill up the screen with a ticker that continually scrolls non stop across the screen with some ridiculous items like, "Breaking News:  Chicago State athletic director James Williams has fired head tennis coach Norm Anderson for undisclosed reasons.  Speculation is that Ben Holbrook will be named the new tennis coach at Chicago State soon".    

Garth

Fwd: OC

Dan Mullen met and married a Salt Lake girl while he was here.  He
probably would take a head job here unless he felt strongly that by
sticking with Meyer he can get a bigger gig somewhere else.  Everybody
should keep their eye on him though.  My son's team is undefeated and
headed for the playoffs.

-Garth

Fwd: OC

Do you think Dan Mullen would be willing to coach us for two years to get a
BCS gig?

 

Bill

Good questions, but I don't know the answers.  I do know that you do not
wait until game day to announce your starting QB.  He needs to know it
is his team and get the reps during the week.  Maybe you withhold the
info from the opposition but the team has to know who the leader is.
Also, we had this discussion last year about putting points on the
board.  On fourth down you always put points on the board and start to
chip away at the score and give the team some confidence especially when
you have the best place kicker in the conference.  Don't change QB's at
half time when you are down 13-0 and the primary problem is OL blocking.

When Florida plays LSU in a couple of weeks it will be Urban Meyer
against Gary Crowton.  Gary is now the OC at LSU and doing a good job.

In answer to some of your questions, who do you think makes these
decisions at Florida?  Now that Notre Dame is off to its worst start in
school history I wonder what their fans who said Meyer's decision to
take the Florida job over their job would make no difference are saying
and thinking now!

 

- Garth


I have a question.



Does the OC decide how the O-line will block?  Does the OC design all
aspects of the play that is to be run?  If the O-line doesn't block
well, who chews out the line coach, the OC or the HC?  Isn't it the HC
who pushes the OC button's, who pushes the other offensive coaches'
buttons, who then push the player's buttons?



Kyle hasn't decided to travel to San Jose State to talk to them to see
how to fix his offense has he?



How could Versteg run such a stagnate offense her but run a good one at
Rutgers?



Any chance that we could get McCoy to leave the pros and be our OC?

 

-Bill


 

UCLA Upset a Confirmed Fluke?

Fair assesment.  I think the players really put themselves at a loss early.  Mistakes made were big ones and affected the momentum of the game (fumbles, personal fouls, etc).  There were a couple questionable coaching calls like the numerous attempts on 4th down conversions when we probably should have kicked field goals.  But despite this I also believe it was the players fault.  They didn't show up to play.  We had good play calling on offense for the most part and we made adjustments on defense second half to stop UNLV's #4 from having a "more spectacular" game.  Defense played their hearts out again, but we lacked on offense and special teams.  Without our decent defense we would have lost 42-0.  They caused turn overs and big plays that gave our "O" several opportunities but we failed to capitalize.  I can't remember the last season we had two opportunites from the 1 yard line to put it in the end zone and failed to do so.  WOW!  My prediction and concern going into this game and the remaineder of the season was the possible and almost innevitable quaterback controversy that would come up.  I didn't think it would happen this soon since Johnson wasn't predicted to play this game.  Instead of having a decent quaterback we have gone to 2 sub par quaterbacks sharing reps in practice.  A very hard decision no doubt for Whit to make.  Funny that as soon as we figure out our running back position our quarterback position goes to pot.  This is why you can't mess around with position competitions during the season.  I feel bad Johnson got injured but a team has to move on.  And if Johnson is going to come back then start him.  The quaterback is the most important element to a football team and he needs all the confidence he can get.  It can't be divided up.  I know BLAH BLAH BLAH.  I'm done.  One more thing.  This has to be classified as the worst game of the year so far.  Not even at Oregon St. or against Air Force did we get shut out.  When was the last time we got shut out? 

 

Let's just hope we can regroup this week. 

 

Eric

UCLA Upset a Confirmed Fluke?

I think it was Bruce who asked if we all thought the game last week was just a fluke.  I think we probably all hesitated to answer...hoping it wasn't and hoping to see similar execution against UNLV.

 

I'll just say a few things:

 

1.  This is the weirdest season in college football I think I have ever seen.  How does a team put the smackdown on a PAC-10 team ranked 11th in the country, who beat BYU the week before, and then lose to a team like UNLV, being completly shut-out of the game?  And things like this are happening around the country.  (How is it that Notre Dame has lost all four so far?)

 

2.  By my calculations, the Ute D has played 6 games worth of football this season.  In each of the losses, it seems like they were on the field the whole game, meaning they have played twice as much as they should have.

 

3.  How could we shut down UCLA's ground game last week, and get destroyed by UNLV's run game this week?

 

4.  UCLA wasn't that bad were they?

 

5.  The UCLA win is now nearly meaningless with a loss like that to UNLV.  I'm glad that game was not on national TV.

 

6.   I will now refrain from even attempting to predict the outcome of the games for the rest of the season.  I have not been right yet.

 

7.   Urban Meyer must have been busy this week.  Either that or someone forgot to call him. 

 

8.   My Dad theorized that maybe SL Mayor Rocky Anderson showed the UCLA team the Salt Lake nightlife and that is why they lost the game.  Maybe Las Vegas Mayor Oscar Goodman got wind of the tactic and used it on us. 

 

9.   Whittingham is racking up some wierd stats.  He defeated the highest ranked non-conference team we have hosted at home, he lost to UNLV for the first time since 1979.  Does anyone know the last time the Utes started the season 1-3?

 

10.   Johnson added nothing to the Utah offense.  Actually, I wonder if he got in the way.  Since he played in this game, I'm almost positive he was in on the reps during practice...which obviously means Grady got half the amount of reps.  In otherwords, the glass was half empty for both quarterbacks, and that's why neither one could show anything.

 

11.  Why did we not use a turn-key player such as "Louie Louie" in those 2 "red-zone" opportunities when we could have changed some momentum in our direction?  (Que Garth's mantra on putting points on the board.  He'll say in all-correctness "an NFL team would have kicked the field goal.")

 

12.  Could we have gift-wrapped the game for UNLV any prettier? 

 

I have to hand it to the coaches though.  I think this loss was purely the players' fault.  Missed tackles, turnovers, penalties, and no offensive execution killed us.

 

I do have to admire the way that Mack and Rogers played as well.  They showed up to play and were the bright spots on an otherwise overshadowed offense.

--
Tijs Limburg
Chairman and CTO of DMX - Digital Media eXceleron, Inc.
Get eXcited!
www.dmxed.com

Blogs:
http://phystrings.blogspot.com/
http://getoutofthedark.blogspot.com/

The "Don't Tread on Me" Flag: The First Navy Jack is enjoying renewed popularity these days thanks to an order from the Secretary of the Navy that directs all U.S. Navy ships to fly the First Navy Jack for the duration of the War on Terrorism.

Fwd: ESPN Link

Kevin Curtis has been especially quiet.  Maybe he is in Brazil looking for another nice brown piece of meat.

Garth

The group has been rather quiet following a very good win.  Did you think it was a fluke?

 

Bruce

 

Fwd: ESPN Link

Thanks for the link.  Boise State at # 14!  Is there any reason why the MWC should not be adding this team immediately?  Typical that Craig Thompson would screw things up.  Utah at # 28, TCU # 24, and BYU #44.  Nice.  Look at all the teams in BCS conferences that get all that $ that are below these teams.  What a joke and sad commentary on the state of college football.

 

ESPN Link

Here is the link to ESPN's College Team Rankings of the Decade:

 

http://sports.espn.go.com/ncf/news/story?id=2947988

 

The rankings are split up into sections, and you can go to each by clicking on the right side of the page.

ESPN Rankings - Top Teams of the Decade

I found this ESPN ranking of the top 100 or so teams of the last decade in College Football interesting.  It places teams just about where I would expect them to be.

 

One thing I found interesting was just how lucky we were to find a coach who could take us from the lackluster 3 seasons that preceeded Meyer, and in two years be romping on Pittsburg in the Fiesta Bowl.  Just look at the teams that are at #30 through #100.  Many of them have had bad records and bad seasons for many decades.  I didnt' realise, for example, that UNLV has had such a bad time.

 

Also, I found it interesting that UCLA, the team we amazingly ground into the turf last Saturday, was ranked in the spot above us at #27.  Take a look at the statistics.  We had better stats all around, but they still favored the PAC-10 team over us:

 

Ladder 119: Nos. 26-50 (from 1997 to 2006)
RANK	TEAM	RECORD	WIN %	TITLES	BOWL RECORD
26	Georgia Tech	79-46	.632	1 conf.	5-5
The Yellow Jackets have only one 10-victory season since sharing the 1990 national championship with Colorado. Georgia Tech went 10-2 in 1998 and shared the ACC title under former coach George O'Leary. Coach Chan Gailey has a 37-27 record in five seasons, but has been dogged by his team's inability to beat its biggest rivals. Last season's 7-1 mark in ACC games was a breakthrough -- but the Jackets still finished 9-5.
27	UCLA	74-47	.612	2 conf.	3-4
The Bruins came within one victory of playing for the national championship in 1998 -- UCLA lost to Miami 49-45 in the regular-season finale and then lost to Wisconsin 38-31 in the Rose Bowl. UCLA has struggled to find that level of excellence ever since, with only one 10-win campaign in the ensuing eight seasons. The Bruins' biggest obstacle has been crosstown rival USC, which has a 7-1 record against UCLA since 1999.
28	Utah	76-41	.650	3 conf.	6-0
The Utes were the first team from a non-BCS conference to play in a BCS bowl game, finishing 12-0 and beating Pittsburgh in the Fiesta Bowl during the 2004 season. Former coach Urban Meyer parlayed that dream season into a job at Florida. The Utes haven't had the same success under successor Kyle Whittingham, who is 15-10 in two seasons, but they might be poised for another big season in 2007.

 

Interesting isn't it?  6-0 in bowl games, including a BCS win, a Las-Vegas rout of USC, and a great victory over Georgia Tech.  We also have a better winning average, and more conference titles. 

 

Obviously it is hard to get any respect.  That is why I'm hoping that what we saw Saturday was the beginning to some more great things on The Hill. 

 

My pick for this Saturday:  Utah 38 (5 TDs - 1 FG) - UNLV 24 (3 TDs - 1 FG)

--
Tijs Limburg
Chairman and CTO of DMX - Digital Media eXceleron, Inc.
Get eXcited!
www.dmxed.com

Blogs:
http://phystrings.blogspot.com/
http://getoutofthedark.blogspot.com/

The "Don't Tread on Me" Flag: The First Navy Jack is enjoying renewed popularity these days thanks to an order from the Secretary of the Navy that directs all U.S. Navy ships to fly the First Navy Jack for the duration of the War on Terrorism.

UCLA Dropped From Rankings after Loss to Utah

All,

 

Wow.  I thought that UCLA might still have a chance to be in the Top 25 even after Saturday's blowout by Utah at Rice-Eccles, but they lost out of all of the polls: AP, USA Today, ESPN Power 16, and the ESPNU Fan poll.  Nice to have some payback for last year right.  Also of note, Meyer's Gators made Tenessee drop from the polls after their huge win.  And Louisville dropped from # 9 to # 18.  Looks like we need to play hard these next few weeks and get a few more wins, and then get ready to beat Louisville and drop them from the polls as well. 

By the way, the Utes are still making front page headlines on ESPN.com.  Go get 'em Utes!  (Man, our new uniforms look good up close...but somehow I don't think Olsen would agree!!)

 

--
Tijs Limburg
Chairman and CTO of DMX - Digital Media eXceleron, Inc.
Get eXcited!
www.dmxed.com

Blogs:
http://phystrings.blogspot.com/
http://getoutofthedark.blogspot.com/

The "Don't Tread on Me" Flag: The First Navy Jack is enjoying renewed popularity these days thanks to an order from the Secretary of the Navy that directs all U.S. Navy ships to fly the First Navy Jack for the duration of the War on Terrorism.

Letting Talent Go

Well said all.  May I just add that I too beleive that recruiting has been a problem at the U?  I have been looking into the recruiting classes and the starting rosters at the U for the past few seasons and i just don't think we have been using the talent weve had to the fullest.  One story I didn't know about, and maybe you older gents may recognize, is that of cornerback Ryan Smith who transferred from the U to Florida in 2006.  Long story short, Urban Meyer called Whit to see if he approved of the transfer.  Meyer said about the call ""I called him and I asked what do you think? He said you do what you've got to do. We have our opinions. He was going to play somewhere though. He was going to 1-AA or try to get eligible right away and he has two years of eligibility left which is kind of a good thing."

 

Smith went on to start for Florida, and is now on the Tennessee Titans.  Just remember that Urban Meyer recruited him and started this guy in six games at the U in 2004.  Why did we "squeeze" him out as it says in the article?  Both coaches (Meyer and Secondary Coach Chuck Heater) wanted him over at Florida.  Wouldn't that signal to you that there is potential there?
 

I've heard people say that Meyer simply didn't recruit and used all of Coach Mac's guys as an excuse for why we have less talent.  Obviously, that is nonesense, as many key players to the 2 year success were brought on by Meyer.  But it seems that, for whatever reason, we've let talent, discipline, and the team as a whole go by the wayside.

 

http://www.gatorcountry.com/football/article/day_3_new_ncaa_rule_works_in_gators_favor/

 

Tijs
 

Blogs:
http://phystrings.blogspot.com/
http://getoutofthedark.blogspot.com/

The "Don't Tread on Me" Flag: The First Navy Jack is enjoying renewed popularity these days thanks to an order from the Secretary of the Navy that directs all U.S. Navy ships to fly the First Navy Jack for the duration of the War on Terrorism.

College Football OFFENSE for Dummies - In the Voice of Big Rick

Well said all!

 

- Van Limburg

 

First...when reading the title of that first book "College Football OFFENSE for Dummies", everyone must hear it as Big Rick would say it.

 

Second, it's frustrating to see the return of mediocrity.  It is unacceptable to me, and should be to all fans, to hear a head coach say to the press that he "doesn't meddle in the offense".  You're the head coach...it is your job to meddle in whatever isn't working.  Obviously the offense isn't working.  We have more ACL injuries than touchdowns this year.  We had this highly touted rank of receivers and we're not seeing it on the field.  I know that the injury to BJ and Asiata really threw us a curve, but that is no excuse.  As has been stated, there is no passion, a lack of discipline, and (I say this with the risk of being kicked down to the bubble) no accountability on this team (can you hear Pony Mendenhall?).

BJ

Blogs:
http://phystrings.blogspot.com/
http://getoutofthedark.blogspot.com/

The "Don't Tread on Me" Flag: The First Navy Jack is enjoying renewed popularity these days thanks to an order from the Secretary of the Navy that directs all U.S. Navy ships to fly the First Navy Jack for the duration of the War on Terrorism.

Kyle's Conference

Kyle said it in the press conference yesterday that coaching evaluations will be done at the end of the season.  He also stated, which is dumbfounding to me, that he "doesn't meddle in the offense."  So basically what Ludwig says and does on offense goes.  Kyle has not control there.  He said he doesn't want to get involved and mess things up.  That says to me he doesn't know what to do on offense even if he did get involved.  Not a good trait as a head coach.  That also shows that he wasn't paying any attention to what Urban was doing while he was here or at any of the meetings, conversations, or camps, including the Fiesta Bowl National Championship game for Florida that Kyle has been involved in.  What is the point of this friendship?  Looks like Urban is getting some good defensive advice but we don't pick anything up.  We are going through the same thing BYU did with Gary Crowten.  He knew offense, but couldn't run a team.  He did well as a coordinator and continues to at Oregon.  Kyle would do the same.  

 

But now at the present what is to be done to salvage this season and get some wins.  If it's money then head coaching change is out of the question.  Cheaper and more efficient now would be to let Ludwig go now.  If this isn't an option either then Kyle needs to check out some books from the library "College Football OFFENSE For Dummies" and "How To Be a Head Coach" this week and then take Ludwig by the balls and say, "This is how we are going to do things."  The responsibility lies with Kyle.  And if he can't get it done then Chris Hill has got to step in. 

 

Just one more thing to add to Kyle's pile is his lack of discipline.  There is none on his team.  The team doesn't have the amount of respect that he needs to lead them to victory.  He is too soft on his players as well as his coaching staff.  Before long he will be Grandpa Whit like Coach Mac.  To confirm this not only was Casteel not repremanded for celebration in the end zone at the Oregon St. game but one of our receivers, Wilson I believe, was charged with a DUI before the Air Force game and still allowed to play.  There are several other universities in the country that would not allow this to happen.  Of all people why Kyle and the U of U.  We have an image of the football team, university, and the state to hold up.  We don't need players like this.  We don't need coaches that don't put their foot down on things like this.  Where was Chris Hill on this issue.  Where is President Young?  Maybe we should ask ourselves "What would Meyer do?"  Ok, just kidding that was a joke to lighten things up.  But really I am disappointed in many aspects.  Truely, "WHAT IS TO BE DONE?"
 

Eric Limburg

--
Tijs Limburg
Chairman and CTO of DMX - Digital Media eXceleron, Inc.
Get eXcited!
www.dmxed.com

Blogs:
http://phystrings.blogspot.com/
http://getoutofthedark.blogspot.com/

The "Don't Tread on Me" Flag: The First Navy Jack is enjoying renewed popularity these days thanks to an order from the Secretary of the Navy that directs all U.S. Navy ships to fly the First Navy Jack for the duration of the War on Terrorism.